Tracing users

[JamesIsCurious 0]

Hey

I've been told by MANY people that all VPN's log, and unfortunately idk who to believe.

If an american were to continuously swat people utilizing your service as a form of protection, you mean to tell me you SINCERELY wouldn't be capable of ceasing the issue, or assisting the authorities in tracking said user down?

I'm having a very hard time believing this, but would like to hear what you have to say. Please don't dodge the question above, I want to hear the sincere repercussions for the above, because I'm finding it very hard to believe that the FBI would accept your we don't log responses to multiple swats coming from your service.

[Staff 9973]

Hey

I've been told by MANY people that all VPN's log, and unfortunately idk who to believe.

If an american were to continuously swat people utilizing your service as a form of protection, you mean to tell me you SINCERELY wouldn't be capable of ceasing the issue, or assisting the authorities in tracking said user down?

Hello!

No investigation based on logs is possible because we don't keep any log on OpenVPN clients traffic. About the USA (since you cite FBI, probably you're thinking of the USA only), there are no USA laws which compel any provider to keep logs. Please read carefully our ToS: if an account allegedly violates our ToS (in particular infringements of the ECHR) AND we are authorized to proceed by the jurisdictional competent magistrate with the aid of competent/specialized authorities, nothing prevents us to perform ex-post investigations if we wish so, just like it happens with any real mere conduit of data. The important difference between us and several VPN providers is that we don't log ex-ante and that we strictly comply to 95/46/EC and 2002/58/EC.

I'm having a very hard time believing this, but would like to hear what you have to say. Please don't dodge the question above, I want to hear the sincere repercussions for the above, because I'm finding it very hard to believe that the FBI would accept your we don't log responses to multiple swats coming from your service.

We can go on forever discussing about what's true or not, so the ultimate argument is that our system has been designed so that you don't need to trust us, please read here:

https://airvpn.org/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&catid=3&id=54&limit=6&limitstart=6&Itemid=142#1745

Partition of trust is sometimes overlooked but it becomes essential when you can't allow yourself to trust a single entity, like your ISP, or a VPN provider.

Kind regards

[JamesIsCurious 0]

Um, I couldn't understand everything you're saying exactly since english is my second language.

I had to use a dictionary which gave me a little clue what you're talking about.

So If I have this correctly once a judge orders you to, you're going to spy on your users with the assistance of the authorities ONLY if they're violating the ECHR?

1.) How does an ex post work, and what happens once you're finished?

2.) Some american CONSTANTLY swats on your VPN, simply tell me what are the repercussions for him? example - we ex post (which basically means i will be doing this & that), once we find the user, his account is suspended, THEN it ends here, or he's arrested. Something as simple as that will make me understand better without keeping this conversation going.

I don't mean to come off rude, but since I can't understand english as good as you can, i'd rather you say it more simple, and get straight to the point buddy. I ask about swat because that is something VERY serious, which tells you the type of anonymity you have.

"The important difference between us and several VPN providers is that we don't log ex-ante and that we strictly comply to 95/46/EC and 2002/58/EC."

I have no clue what 95/46/EC or 2002/58/EC is...but I presume you're saying that you ignore everyone else besides where your located?

Thanks for helping me out so far.

[Staff 9973]

Um, I couldn't understand everything you're saying exactly since english is my second language.

I had to use a dictionary which gave me a little clue what you're talking about.

So If I have this correctly once a judge orders you to, you're going to spy on your users with the assistance of the authorities ONLY if they're violating the ECHR?

1.) How does an ex post work, and what happens once you're finished?

Hello!

That depends on the investigation methods chosen by the proper authorities and on the alleged crime. We can't spy on our customers, the investigation methods are not our competence.

2.) Some american CONSTANTLY swats on your VPN, simply tell me what are the repercussions for him? example - we ex post (which basically means i will be doing this & that), once we find the user, his account is suspended, THEN it ends here, or he's arrested. Something as simple as that will make me understand better without keeping this conversation going.

I don't mean to come off rude, but since I can't understand english as good as you can, i'd rather you say it more simple, and get straight to the point buddy. I ask about swat because that is something VERY serious, which tells you the type of anonymity you have.

Sorry, we don't understand the scenario depicted in your phrases as well.

[EDIT] In case you're speculating about a scenario in which the adversary has the power to monitor the VPN provider servers, then again the technical solution to defeat such an adversary is performing partition of trust as described in the post linked in the previous message.

Kind regards

[JamesIsCurious 0]

*sighs*...

You don't understand the scenario of 'some american is constantly swatting someone while using your VPN, what is the punishments for him'?

Why complicate things, and dodge the questions?

My question was just hypothetical anyways to see if this 'no logs, your 100%' anonymous thing is safe, but this thread is telling me other wise...

I mean you don't log, but you're capable of doing multiple methods for tracking users down...and you don't even tell what are the repercussions for people after you're done with the ex post.

[Staff 9973]

*sighs*...

You don't understand the scenario of 'some american is constantly swatting someone while using your VPN, what is the punishments for him'?

Why complicate things, and dodge the questions?

My question was just hypothetical anyways to see if this 'no logs, your 100%' anonymous thing is safe, but this thread is telling me other wise...

I mean you don't log, but you're capable of doing multiple methods for tracking users down...and you don't even tell what are the repercussions for people after you're done with the ex post.

Hello!

We can tell you ad nauseam that we don't log and we respect privacy of our customers etc. but IF you can't trust us and/or if you think that your adversary has the power to control the VPN servers, THEN the only safe solution is performing partition of trust: this a technical solution to defeat ANY adversary that spies on you directly on the VPN server.

Kind regards

[pj 72]

Hey

I've been told by MANY people that all VPN's log, and unfortunately idk who to believe.

Hello!

This is the exact core content of an HideMyAss statement after the affair which involved one of their customers and it is still the only available mantra that was repeated by HMA to explain their actions and try to insinuate without proof that all VPN services act like HMA itself. I don't know and I don't want to know the reasons for which you published this slogan in our forum and respectfully all the necessary answers under the scenario for which you can't trust us (especially technical solutions) have been thoroughly given. If you have further unanswered questions please do not hesitate to contact us.

Kind regards

pj

AirVPN

[JamesIsCurious 0]

:laugh:

Thanks for the responses guys.

I understand now, this type of scenario is too extreme for you to answer in the way that I'd like you, which is why you worded yours that way. I'll take your word that this is as anonymous as you claim then.

Any suggestions on another logless VPN to chain on top of AirVPN?

Surely the admin has connections, and knows of some people who are legit.

AirVpn + Something else rather than tor, I'd like a no logs VPN, any recommendations?

Considering it will literally look like this

AirVpn + Another VPN in that exact order.

[ringtin 3]

We can tell you ad nauseam that we don't log and we respect privacy of our customers etc. but IF you can't trust us and/or if you think that your adversary has the power to control the VPN servers, THEN the only safe solution is performing partition of trust: this a technical solution to defeat ANY adversary that spies on you directly on the VPN server.

Kind regards

lol........very good......probably the best customer-relations-preserving comeback that I've read this year.

Hope you don't mind if I steal this (paraphrased).

On a slightly different topic, great vpn service! (from a former HMA user) Thanks for your patient competence.